:1st: I don't that knew I had stolen nudity frist price from Kenneth (Deviant Viking)Kenny! Do you had count only the "Human Nudity" or gave me points for the "Non Human Nudity" too? And for God Sake how do you know that the aliens is not dressed? :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:
But I agree that the best is ignore them and stay on our :thumb: path!
I promise that when the new rules are done Human and Aliens will follow them! :lol:
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I was pointing out what a person had said about a person getting into a tub with a Posette. It in no way really means anything except the point vonfranck was getting accross about Davide and the tub. Then I look at this as a big thing between the works of art. Davide using himself as a model and I use this loosely because if it isn't Davide then we have got a new problem with Posy in the tub and vonfranck's art with other real people with Poser heads put on the bodies. We can not look at it as 100 percent fact it is none Poser because it is quite diffirent. I have never seen that style before and for some of it, it looks very good. As for the pictures that Davide had deleted. I don't think I have seen them. I had a piece of art as you may remember of the title called Goth 1:25 which was thrown out at R'osity. It was nude and in a somewhat torchered way. But I was trying to make a point and the rules over threw. I was mad but I had to obey the rules that had been set up at Renderosity. We have to look at the art for its intent. Maybe we need to have the person explain the art and then it will be desided if it should have it. Maybe before he or she uploads the art it should be in plain English along with some other languages that there is no nudity and they agree to the claus. Then if we remove it, then they can't say anything about it. :thumb: As for JR's Aliens not being dressed. One of them was not happy with thier contract and reported you to me. :wink: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:
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Bit late, but have followed the whole sorry saga!
Davide, you have always had my support in these matters. At the end of the day it's your site. And if anything, god forbid, should ever happen in a legal sense, it's your ass on the line. Anyone who thinks different needs to get real.
As I have said elsewhere in the forum, the internet is no longer a place of Anonymous 'nicks' doing whatever they want without repercussions. This is part of the wider community and is judged by its rules.
Something about our 'movie-star' namesake members never quite felt right. I had a suspicion that they may be the same person for some time, or at lease a group of trolls out for some fun... Just didn't smell right :mmmh:
Davide, you have always had my support in these matters. At the end of the day it's your site. And if anything, god forbid, should ever happen in a legal sense, it's your ass on the line. Anyone who thinks different needs to get real.
As I have said elsewhere in the forum, the internet is no longer a place of Anonymous 'nicks' doing whatever they want without repercussions. This is part of the wider community and is judged by its rules.
Something about our 'movie-star' namesake members never quite felt right. I had a suspicion that they may be the same person for some time, or at lease a group of trolls out for some fun... Just didn't smell right :mmmh:
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The reason that I tried to bring the source of names topic back to life, was in hopes that the others but mostly Christopher and then Robert to discuss the shource of their user names. The name Christopher Lee combined with an avatar of the actor was an immediate red flag for me. However, at the time it seemded that it was possible that he was the actor, unlikely but possible.
Two prior sites that "these people" have been are Rendervisions and Renderosity. I first encountered Gojira at Rendervisions a while ago in the form of his comments on my works uploaded there. As I recall, he had some artwork posted there at the time. He has removed all of them from that site. I also located Anouk at that site, also just as empty. At Renderosity they were there as a group, they formed a web of favorite artists lists. Then they removed all their art from that site too. Only one factal remains in one of heir galleries there, I think that one was lest behind by accident. The reason I know that they had art works there is that they are in each others favorites lists, a far as I can tell, the Renderosity software does not permit you to add someone to your favorite artists list if that person has an empty gallery.
Pangor
Two prior sites that "these people" have been are Rendervisions and Renderosity. I first encountered Gojira at Rendervisions a while ago in the form of his comments on my works uploaded there. As I recall, he had some artwork posted there at the time. He has removed all of them from that site. I also located Anouk at that site, also just as empty. At Renderosity they were there as a group, they formed a web of favorite artists lists. Then they removed all their art from that site too. Only one factal remains in one of heir galleries there, I think that one was lest behind by accident. The reason I know that they had art works there is that they are in each others favorites lists, a far as I can tell, the Renderosity software does not permit you to add someone to your favorite artists list if that person has an empty gallery.
Pangor
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Now on to the main topic, reworking or rewording the album rules.
I accept the offer to volunteer. ;-)
The first thing I would like to say about it, is that I like thing here just as they already are. It already functions well for the community the we, the staff and the other long term regular members, have together with our webmaster have created. For our family of friends there is no problem, let us not punish ourselves because of a few recient "trouble makers".
Tormie, please don't use the word "Censor" when talking about this issue. It has a bad connotation that bad people can use to try to make us look like the bad guys.
It has been suggested to make changes to or replace the album software required to provide nudity, or violence controls or to limit access to "restricted content". Or to require nudity warnings in the titles of the pictures. I don't think these are good idea for PF. For nudity warnings to do any good, we will have to change from automatic thumbnails to thumbnails that we will have to upload. Otherwise the nudity would already be visible in the thumbnail. A second problem is that any restriction would require alteration to phpBB/IntegraMOD too, at least on the profile settings and "The Pic Of The Click!".
If some people come to depend on that feature to "protect" them from exposure to undesired content, what happens if there is a bug and the system fails to block all such content, there will another situation of angered people. What iwe make an error an fail to flag one of our picture appropriatly or if a trouble maker were to upload picutres that violate the rules and includes that part in the thumbnail and does not flag the image? Our album is the most flexible that I have yet seen anywhere and runs just as smoothly as it is feature rich.
An angered person could have a stronger case based on our failure to provide reasonable protection that the angered person could argue that he or she had a reason to expect.
A point of comparison, there was an incident at Tapestry of Dreams a few months ago that lead to the same sort of questions that we are now considering. It was resolved by changing nothing other than: Blocking all access to the album by guest; changed the age limit for registering to 18 and over. When other options were considered, each step lead to more and more complex solutions. Simple solutions all lead to more stringent ones. Otherwise,
We as a result of the recent incidents we have removed all privliges for album access by guests.
(A detail from the incident at Tapestry of Dreams, IF ANYONE sees a new member named "DragonWizard" or something similar, it is time to panic and if he invites 40 to 50 of his friends, it IS time to run in the streets screaming.)
At FaerieTop the entry screen has this message "WARNING: Artistic Nudity Ahead!"
There is a simple to understand and concise set of rules at another site. I have asked the webmaster of the site who is also the author of those rules for permission to use them as an example in our discussions here.
Pangor
I accept the offer to volunteer. ;-)
The first thing I would like to say about it, is that I like thing here just as they already are. It already functions well for the community the we, the staff and the other long term regular members, have together with our webmaster have created. For our family of friends there is no problem, let us not punish ourselves because of a few recient "trouble makers".
Tormie, please don't use the word "Censor" when talking about this issue. It has a bad connotation that bad people can use to try to make us look like the bad guys.
It has been suggested to make changes to or replace the album software required to provide nudity, or violence controls or to limit access to "restricted content". Or to require nudity warnings in the titles of the pictures. I don't think these are good idea for PF. For nudity warnings to do any good, we will have to change from automatic thumbnails to thumbnails that we will have to upload. Otherwise the nudity would already be visible in the thumbnail. A second problem is that any restriction would require alteration to phpBB/IntegraMOD too, at least on the profile settings and "The Pic Of The Click!".
If some people come to depend on that feature to "protect" them from exposure to undesired content, what happens if there is a bug and the system fails to block all such content, there will another situation of angered people. What iwe make an error an fail to flag one of our picture appropriatly or if a trouble maker were to upload picutres that violate the rules and includes that part in the thumbnail and does not flag the image? Our album is the most flexible that I have yet seen anywhere and runs just as smoothly as it is feature rich.
An angered person could have a stronger case based on our failure to provide reasonable protection that the angered person could argue that he or she had a reason to expect.
A point of comparison, there was an incident at Tapestry of Dreams a few months ago that lead to the same sort of questions that we are now considering. It was resolved by changing nothing other than: Blocking all access to the album by guest; changed the age limit for registering to 18 and over. When other options were considered, each step lead to more and more complex solutions. Simple solutions all lead to more stringent ones. Otherwise,
We as a result of the recent incidents we have removed all privliges for album access by guests.
(A detail from the incident at Tapestry of Dreams, IF ANYONE sees a new member named "DragonWizard" or something similar, it is time to panic and if he invites 40 to 50 of his friends, it IS time to run in the streets screaming.)
At FaerieTop the entry screen has this message "WARNING: Artistic Nudity Ahead!"
There is a simple to understand and concise set of rules at another site. I have asked the webmaster of the site who is also the author of those rules for permission to use them as an example in our discussions here.
Pangor
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This is very interesting but the question remains. Was this site set up and where do we go from here. For when it all comes down to it I'm in full agreement with Ozzy. We can back Davide up but it is his site and it all falls down on him. Ok lets assume they or someone has been offended about an art that they see as no diffirent as some seen already here. Where do we draw the line. What safe measures do we make so it doesn't happen again? I for one welcome artist here but we where over welmed with Fractals instead of the norm. Poser and bryce in background. That is what this site founded itself on. The bottom line is simple. You don't obey the rules you get hammered. I still think that there should be a page simple and brief that pops up in front of you everytime you start to upload stateing. Under no reason what so ever you put anything of Child Porn, Nudity that will offend anyone in anyway with out the permission of the web master posting it for you his or herself. If the web master is in doubt on how to approach the art then it is a vote by the Mods. If rejected then he or she has the full backup of the Mods to say no. If the offense continues then the artist will be asked in a nice manner that the material is not in the best interest of the site and recommend alternate sites to place it in. Should the artist become angry then at this time inform them of the rules they agreed too. Last of all ban them from the site. It won't be the first time and sad to say I guess it will not be the last. What do you all say about this. I think it is time to do something and make it work. I think it is time to unlock the door and turn on the porch light again. :)
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I agree with Ozy and Kenny, as I said, I like how things are here. Now with this forum, we have a new tool to deal with such matters as problem picture in the album.
There is one thing missing. I was thinking about approvals routines in the album. I believe that approval and disapproval of pictures in not functional at this time. Therefore I have added a new gallery named "Testing", with the description of "For testing of experimental features by the staff."
Both the name and the description are a cover for the real reason for that gallery. Rather than "Testing" think of it as "Disapproved". When a picture is seen by one of us, or we are responding to a complaint, rather than deleting the picture right away or leaving it visible to the general membership, (or visible to the general public via the guest account, assuming that we will be relaxing the recent tightning of permissions) move that picture into the "Testing" gallery, once there we can discuss it and deal with it. If it is accepted, the picture can be moved back to its original gallery, if it is determined that it need to be removed, it can be deleted from there once all discussions about it have ended and any appeals by the artist have been considered.
The reason for the name "Testing" is as to not alarm the more jumpy members like those that objected to this forum. Therefore, we must not mention the real purpose of that gallery outside of this forum or via private messages between us.
I have set permision for the Testing gallery so that it is accessible only by Admin, Aministrators and Moderators. All other user classes have no permissions in that gallery. I have not tested it yet, so do not consider it secure yet. I am getting tired and may have overlooked something.
I will test it sometime tomarrow.
Pangor
There is one thing missing. I was thinking about approvals routines in the album. I believe that approval and disapproval of pictures in not functional at this time. Therefore I have added a new gallery named "Testing", with the description of "For testing of experimental features by the staff."
Both the name and the description are a cover for the real reason for that gallery. Rather than "Testing" think of it as "Disapproved". When a picture is seen by one of us, or we are responding to a complaint, rather than deleting the picture right away or leaving it visible to the general membership, (or visible to the general public via the guest account, assuming that we will be relaxing the recent tightning of permissions) move that picture into the "Testing" gallery, once there we can discuss it and deal with it. If it is accepted, the picture can be moved back to its original gallery, if it is determined that it need to be removed, it can be deleted from there once all discussions about it have ended and any appeals by the artist have been considered.
The reason for the name "Testing" is as to not alarm the more jumpy members like those that objected to this forum. Therefore, we must not mention the real purpose of that gallery outside of this forum or via private messages between us.
I have set permision for the Testing gallery so that it is accessible only by Admin, Aministrators and Moderators. All other user classes have no permissions in that gallery. I have not tested it yet, so do not consider it secure yet. I am getting tired and may have overlooked something.
I will test it sometime tomarrow.
Pangor
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For the "Borg group" I explain a little how the registration system works here: It's enough to use different mail addresses to register how many accounts you want, so you've simply to log out and login with the new account, the system don't watch the ip address. Is it possible to log in with the same ip address and two or more different accounts, like if me and my brother on a different PC but using the same internet connection want to login togetherer, it's possible (Posy :heartbeat: logs in with me sometimes, we are logged in together ). Again, if someone disable cookies the program of the site, phpBB uses something called "session id" a long serie of number after the url address so that is also easier to change identity on the fly. The suspect for these guys to be the same person is due to some facts:
- The login from the same location because they use the same ip address or they use the same proxy server
- They never login together, that is very strange, so they do things sequentially, like if it's the same person who login, then logout and login again with the same identity.
- The identities are too much "characterized", if they (?) would have choosen, for example, an italian, he would have spoken a sort of english-italian slang and have some "typical" behaviour.
The japanese guy "sakuma" is very strange because as long as I know japaneses know english very well, sakuma is a character in the movie "Gojira". Gojira was the first to create an account here and he is called "the big guy" from all of them.
In any case it changes nothing for what happened, it's only a thrilling and intriguing thing, a real mistery for halloween :lol:. If he/she is really only one person he made a great work... In any case he left some traces because probably he isn't very expert in internet things. If I would have done the same thing I would have used some proxys or anonymizers for the different identities in order to change the ip address and I would have logged in in the same moment with different accounts, from the same pc simply using a different browser (for example internet explorer and firefox).
The second matter about the album. Personally I'm not against nudity, it depends on how it is showed and the "style" we want for Posetteforever. If we want a larger target we can't permit "hard" or "explicit" pictures and real naked people.
About my pictures, the one in the tub doesn't show genitals and I represented myself with a Michael 2 who show the naked back. The woman is a victoria 2 and shows the breast, I added "me" on the picture made by someone else for a laugh, and it's not inteded as an erotic situation at all.
I substantially agree with you Kenny for the second one, it could be "too much"...
However, after we have decided clear rules (if it can be really possible) I'll remove also my pictures if they are out of the rules, no problem.
For the last passages of your post Kenny, I invite all of you to correct my broken english expecially when I write something like rules or descriptions for the forum or announcements. You can even edit the post directly, no problem.
And about erotic or perverted or violent or else pictures you're right, at last is a matter of reasonableness. Instead of directly delete the picture (as I've done :oops: ) we could put it in an "unapproved" status, for example moving it to a special gallery where only the moderators have access and then decide here what to do. I think I can do it. the picture can also be approved before public showing but can't be "unapproved", to do it I have to manually edit the database and it's a mess.
About women's opinion, I'm just waiting :whistle: :whistle: :whistle: Where are them ?
- The login from the same location because they use the same ip address or they use the same proxy server
- They never login together, that is very strange, so they do things sequentially, like if it's the same person who login, then logout and login again with the same identity.
- The identities are too much "characterized", if they (?) would have choosen, for example, an italian, he would have spoken a sort of english-italian slang and have some "typical" behaviour.
The japanese guy "sakuma" is very strange because as long as I know japaneses know english very well, sakuma is a character in the movie "Gojira". Gojira was the first to create an account here and he is called "the big guy" from all of them.
In any case it changes nothing for what happened, it's only a thrilling and intriguing thing, a real mistery for halloween :lol:. If he/she is really only one person he made a great work... In any case he left some traces because probably he isn't very expert in internet things. If I would have done the same thing I would have used some proxys or anonymizers for the different identities in order to change the ip address and I would have logged in in the same moment with different accounts, from the same pc simply using a different browser (for example internet explorer and firefox).
The second matter about the album. Personally I'm not against nudity, it depends on how it is showed and the "style" we want for Posetteforever. If we want a larger target we can't permit "hard" or "explicit" pictures and real naked people.
About my pictures, the one in the tub doesn't show genitals and I represented myself with a Michael 2 who show the naked back. The woman is a victoria 2 and shows the breast, I added "me" on the picture made by someone else for a laugh, and it's not inteded as an erotic situation at all.
I substantially agree with you Kenny for the second one, it could be "too much"...
However, after we have decided clear rules (if it can be really possible) I'll remove also my pictures if they are out of the rules, no problem.
For the last passages of your post Kenny, I invite all of you to correct my broken english expecially when I write something like rules or descriptions for the forum or announcements. You can even edit the post directly, no problem.
And about erotic or perverted or violent or else pictures you're right, at last is a matter of reasonableness. Instead of directly delete the picture (as I've done :oops: ) we could put it in an "unapproved" status, for example moving it to a special gallery where only the moderators have access and then decide here what to do. I think I can do it. the picture can also be approved before public showing but can't be "unapproved", to do it I have to manually edit the database and it's a mess.
About women's opinion, I'm just waiting :whistle: :whistle: :whistle: Where are them ?
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LOL, the funny thing is that pangor had the same idea about the album :lol: and we wrote the message nearly together!
(maybe pangor and me are not really real :uuh: )
(maybe pangor and me are not really real :uuh: )
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well, i'm a woman - checks in mirror to make sure :lol: and what do i think. Well i do have a naked Dork with genital showing in the gallery. And 2 pics i think of an embrace with naked Dork and Posette. THe last 2 are meant as romantic and not erotic or porno.
I say no to photos of real ppls's genitals, naked kids or kids(3d or real) in erotic poses or with seethrough clothing, pornpix, 3dppl having sex with other 3dppl or animals or objects. THe reason for the no sex with animals is because i was surfing the net looking for new 3dsites and came across a site with that, without even warning ppl. I definently say no to that.
THe problem is that it's all subjective, the artist might see something else than the viewer/s do.... IT's all in the context of the image.
I say no to photos of real ppls's genitals, naked kids or kids(3d or real) in erotic poses or with seethrough clothing, pornpix, 3dppl having sex with other 3dppl or animals or objects. THe reason for the no sex with animals is because i was surfing the net looking for new 3dsites and came across a site with that, without even warning ppl. I definently say no to that.
THe problem is that it's all subjective, the artist might see something else than the viewer/s do.... IT's all in the context of the image.
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I must thought it before but I have a suspicion about the "Borg Group" what all of you need to know. Gojira... The monster... A sweet girl... Another not so sweet... but relatives... The Captain... for God Sake don't remind someone to you?
Our old friend Den Tracy!!! All this can be a joke! :doh:
Our old friend Den Tracy!!! All this can be a joke! :doh:
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Last edited by Tormie on 04 Oct 2005 11:34; edited 1 time in total
I don't know :mmmh: ... It could be but I don't know... I banned for a long time the ip address from the service provider of Den Tracy so he could connect here only via a proxy or an anonymizer but we've to check if those IPs belongs from a proxy. However I don't recognize the style of DT in those pictures :mmmh: :mmmh: :mmmh: ... Hovere all is possible !
Last edited by Tormie on 04 Oct 2005 11:34; edited 1 time in total
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i don't either..there was a dtracy1 online earlier today.
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no, is dtacy1 and I checked his email address, it seems "clean"
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oki, i read it too fast. :whistle:
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