Well friends, what do you think ?

Today at PoserPros, I saw a post from an artist that had the
name "Bonnie" in it.  It was a product to be launched at DAZ and
possibly other sites as well.
The character was called "Bonnie" for V3

I asked that the name be changed because the 3D character name "Bonnie" is used by me and people identify "Bonnie" with me as the artist.
The reply was "Sorry...we searched the stores and the name was not used and
we are not going to change it."

A friend of mine replied that it should be out of courtesy not to use a name
of a character that is seen all over the net on different Poser sites.
The reply was that the launch of the package would cost more money and be
delayed.
My friend also told me in a PM to let it go and that the rival "Bonnie" would
be forgotten in a few months.

I replied to the author that the concept and idea of a 3D character called "Bonnie" was my idea and character, not theirs.

The image and thread were removed by the admins over there.
I have asked DAZ to delay the product launch until another name could be
found.
Oh yeah, one of the two artists on the "Bonnie" project said that she
never, ever heard of my Bonnie character.  It proves that people only look
at what their small circle of clique friends produce and IGNORE EVERYONE ELSE.
I didn't want a fight on my hands.
All I asked for was a name change.
What's mine is mine.

Opinions anyone ?

I hope that all will go fine for you and your Bonnie Den. I think that the authors of that character are sincere about her, Bonnie is a common name and I think that they haven't stolen it... Anyway, if it hurts you you'll have our support...

If someone would use "Posy" for a commercial product I would laugh about it, Posy is Posy       ...

In any case "that" Bonnie can't be confused with your Bonnie, no way (the V3 Bonnie has a cup A or B maximum       )

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I'm thinking you were in the right Den, although I don't really know much about it. But you do have alot of proof that you have been using Bonnie for much longer then their release of theirs. I would almost think of it as a copyright infringment....

I dunno. I still stand behind what I said, "you are in the right"

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I'd rather have a bottle in front of me then a frontal lobotomy.......

My grey matter is turning white, my proof is my grey hair....

This is the reason if you are going to post a picture Den and you have future plains with the character you simply do not remove it. IT is like a copy right law in the music industry.You make lyrics and music charts.Put them in an envelope.Take it to the post master.He stamps and dates it and returns it to you.Never to be opened the date on the stamp is your copyright of your work.A poor mans way of doing it but effective.With you how ever you make a cd of your work put it an envelope and do the same.Also leaving your work out on sites have the date you made it.It also states a right to your claim that it's yours. Also proof that they have a legal problem with your work vs theirs.I agree it is screwed up and I would fight for what is yours.

... In any case Den, You've our full support, we're a true group of Bonnie fans and we can post our opinion everywhere, if that characters will be on sale and you don't want, they will hear our voice in the forums... We'll help you !  

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Saw the post on PP (which now seems to have disappeared, surprise).
I agree that they should change the name out of courtsey (and the part of one of the artist not even being familiar with Bonnie was either a blatant lie, or it tells a little about the artists anyway..)
But appart from that, I'm afraid they're right. Unethical and just 'not nice', but I don't really think you can stop them if they go through with it.
Appart from it being a Poser character, and named Bonnie, there isn't really anything in common with yours and theirs figure. And believe me, I've for various reasons started to look closer at ways to call people on their frauds and ways around stuff (special thanks to my landlords for that), but I think your case against them would hang in a thin thread at best.
It started to look like the incident with that manipulated photo I did. Thinking back on it, I don't think any of the solutions was a particulary good one. I made the pic without her concsent, but she overreacted way much. I got pissed and let it fuck up for me, so I decided to try and save the rest of my face and just removed the damn thing as she wanted.
Didn't make me look to good at the time, but not her either. Looks pretty much the same with this one.
If they change the name, you'll come off as a zealous artist over-protecting his work. They release the figure under the name Bonnie, they come off as pissing on their fellow artists and ignoring their work.
It's a lose-lose situation, but imho I think it'd be best if you just let them use the name. That way, at least you'll come out as the more gracious of you guys.
Some guy had blatantly used one of my Najove poritraits for some 2D pic, and claimed it was based on some Poser work of his (which he later said was an attempt at doing my Najove, so he was still copying her).
I really wanted to just say what it was, which is a blatant ripoff.. instead I commented it looked nice, and said it reminded me of some of my work. Didn't like it, but I'd just come off as the asshole if I complained.

Probably looks like I'm against you, but I'm not. Just my opinion and what I think would be best to do in this situation, which just sucks

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Every night will have a day.
Even forever must come to an end. I think...

I can help you, [i:00327444b7]Picciotto[/i:00327444b7]... Only ask and they will sleep with fishes soon...

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keep your friends close, and your enemies closer

...     

      Speaking of laws, I think that Den could be right: He named "Bonnie" a Poser character and someone else called a Poser character with the same name: is like if someone called a car with the name of another car...

If I was the author of the new "Bonnie" I changed the name, no problem, there are a lot of names to choose if there is a problem with a particular one, even if I think that they used it unintentionally, that Bonnie can't be an imitation of your...

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P.S. I don't understand why they erased the thread at Poserpros, it shouldn't be their politics and it sounds very strange to me... But I'm away from their forum since more than an year and things could be changed...      

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'Bonnie' is just a name though. There are tons of people with the same names.
If the Bonnie character they're making resembled Den's Bonnie to a great extent, then of course they should pull it, but there isnt any similairties between them except being Poser figures.

As for the missing thread, it's possible the author decided to delete the pic, taking the thread with it

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Every night will have a day.
Even forever must come to an end. I think...

     I searched the gallery and ther is a "Bonnie" picture dated 21th June...

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Bonnie is a common name, but there is only one genuine Bonnie 3D Poser character, MINE...

I never asked for the thread to be erased. Either the admins did it or the poster of the image
did it.
There's plenty of other names to choose from.
My character has a personality all her own and I don't want to see ads with a prissy looking
Poser Barbie doll.
Over zealous ? Me ?
No, just protecting my own creation, that's all.
They can go ahead if they like, but the won't get much respect from other artists.
If they do, then the artists who purchase the product have no integrity as far as I'm
concerned.
How do you think DAZ would react if I made a new mesh model and called her Victoria or
Stephanie and started selling it.
They would shit their pants and do everything in their power to stop me.

I'm not mad about it, but I think it shows that some people in the Poser world
have little respect or care for their fellow artists.
Since the concept and idea of a 3D character named "Bonnie" was mine, it is by law, my intellectual property.  I thought of it first and it is well known in Poser communities.
It's the same as Mickey Mouse and Donald Duck being created by Walt Disney.
...or Bugs Bunny and the Roadrunner, by their respective artists.
 Shrek, Woody, Buzz Lightyear and other 3D characters were created by someone and it is their
property.

Den Tracy";p="10747 wrote: 

It's the same as Mickey Mouse and Donald Duck being created by Walt Disney.
...or Bugs Bunny and the Roadrunner, by their respective artists.
 Shrek, Woody, Buzz Lightyear and other 3D characters were created by someone and it is their
property.

Point well made!!

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I'd rather have a bottle in front of me then a frontal lobotomy.......

My grey matter is turning white, my proof is my grey hair....

Den,

In my opinion you have a moral, maybe even legal right to be pissed off. For an atrist at any level intelectual property theft is an important issue. In a perfect world we would all fight for each other tooth and nail to protect artist rights.

Unfortunately in the real world we seem to operate under the 'might is right' credo. The fact that there is a considerable financial backer to the product with, I would imagine, an experienced (aggressive ) legal team on their side will make them confident enough to carry on regardless.

Ethically I believe they should change the name of the product, they are a leader in the 3D and Poser community and should set a high standard in this type of case. But...

Den, I would go on posting your Bonnie & Co. images and let it all blow over, if I were you. Those who purchase the product are more than likely not 'fans' of your 'toons and characters. They will tire of playing with the character after a few weeks and move on to the next DAZ/Renderosity/PPros/RDNA release.

It is unfortunate, but without a major kerfuffle, unpreventable. It's up to you how far you want to take it. A formal letter from a solicitor/lawyer to DAZ requesting them to C&D might have some effect, but you could be opening a can of worms with more legal tangles than you need  

Keep us informed, mate. But don't loose sleep over it.

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Computer Lie #1: You'll never use all that disk space.

"I love deadlines. I like the whooshing sound as they fly by." - Douglas Adams

I won't lose any sleep over it.
I simply will have little use for the two "artists" who went through with it and anyone who buys it,
should it be released as Bonnie.
If it should come out, be prepared for the "real" 3D Bonnie to get a hold of the rival
and beat the daylights out of her in some renders.
Fair is fair in wartime...  
 
Besides, the rival looks like she couldn't fight her way out of a Rodeo Drive boutique
in Beverly Hills, even if she were two feet away from the door and the door partially open.  
The rival is just another zombie Poser character with no personality.
It will be nothing more than a dressup doll.

I believe the whole episode shows a lack of courtesy towards another Poser artist.